ceiling raiseded, that will be raised for a year, maybe two. that's all we're going to get, and we'll be in the soup and having the same conversation. >> do you think that's true even if -- i mean, this is a pie in the sky scenario. what if the republicans lose the house in 2014? we are looking at the numbers as they do, they lost -- the notion that they could get a balanced budget plan in ten years is basically poppy cock, and would you have to cut discretionary spending in half in order to do that. >> frank is also right. democrats will have to come to the table too. you have to ultimately balance the budget. you can'tco what we're doing no matter what side of the aisle you're on, and so, you know, whether you think the democrats take the house or whether the republicans keep the house, ultimately something has to happen, and by the way, i do expect the democrats will come to the table with something because i think if they don't, i think that the general public is actually much more in the middle than after the election results ultimately su